Aingeal Rose & Ahonu went to the top of Pilot Butte in Bend, Oregon to view the sunset. Little did they know that it would spawn two episodes of The Honest-to-God Series. This is Part 1. While watching the sunset, they discussed everything from ascension to death and dying. It all arose from weeks and weeks of exploring why living is such an effort, why we must eat in order to live, why we consume other lifeforms, and why we die. There is a transcript below of Part 1 of our discussion entitled, "Sunset on Pilot Butte" Well now, Aingeal Rose, here we are at the top of Pilot Butte. It's a volcanic rock just in the city of Bend. Actually, it's one of the few cities in the world that has a volcano in its city perimeter. Is it wise for us to be living here, Ahonu? I don't know about that, Aingeal Rose. Imagine, we're on the rim. We're actually... so, yeah, you know you always put me on the rim of these places, Ahonu! Now, we've got something very important to discuss - that's why we're here. We have looked at why living is such an effort before. Mmm. We've looked at why we have to eat in order to live, and we've looked at why we have to breathe in order to live, and none of that makes sense for spirit beings. Like, if you consider for a second, if we were to believe for a moment at all, that we are spirit beings, why would a spirit being be subject to those limitations and restrictions? And the only answer would be that there's something funny going on. The spirit being believes something, or there's something in its creation, or something in its manifestation here on this planet that is causing these limitations to be here. The breathing, the eating, and the physical nature of our bodies. And then there was something else that you pointed out earlier on which really spawned this discussion, and that is that bodies die because they're tired. They get worn out. Right. You know, there's a specific life span of whatever it might be, seventy, eighty, or hundred years, but then it dies. The body can't sustain it. Now, the question then arises well, why would a spirit being manifest into something like that? What's going on that the physical body, and the entire physicality of the Earth and the universe and all that? What's going on that is is not true of the spirit that we talk about, when we talk about the godliness that we are part of. So, there's something funny going on and we we want to get to the bottom of it, and we're going to do it in next 25 minutes. I know you're laughing - I see! Aingeal Rose, let me ask you, what was it that you realized today? Well, what I realized wasn't so much about why we made the body or anything like that, it was more the fact that we believe that we manifested something solid and finite, that is independent, and therefore separated from the cosmic energy that's all around us, for example. And what I realized was that there is an unlimited supply of lifeforce energy within us, that we literally are the God within. We literally are the way, the truth, and the life, and each one of us is. So, that's actually what we're made up of. We're made up of the plasma of the universe which you can call God, or unlimited life force, or abundant supply. But it actually runs through our body as water, and we've all read the scientific studies that we are made up of what, 75% water, 90% water. I don't know the exact figure but the majority of us is water, okay, and we literally are the waters of life.o So, if you go back and you look at Emoto's... Dr. Emoto's studies with water crystals, a lot of people are familiar with him now and his work, and how he would take different crystals and freeze them, or different water molecules and freeze them and they'd all come out with these different patterns, and if you change the thoughts into the water then the crystals would change. And so, what happened today was that I was realizing that we are made up of this living water. It makes up what appears to be our physical body, but it really is a watery plasma light field. And you know, we've studied the Course In Miracles for many years and that book has so many different levels to it, but you know, there's a lot in the course about how you're not a body, that you're really free, you're not... One of the lines is, "I am NOT a body. I am free. I am as God created me." And that might seem to deny the body, but it's not denying the body. What it's doing is saying, you aren't that. You're not this solid, finite, physical thing, cut off from the supply of the universe. But in layman's terms Aingeal Rose, are we, is that like me believing that I am this body and that's what keeps me here? Is it down to that level? It's not so much about keeping you here or not keeping you here. We're not talking about that we should get out of the physical universe or anything like that. We're talking about the perceived limitations that we have going on in our minds about what we are. So, like if you believe that all you are is this physical body that needs external things to keep it alive, it has to keep feeding it in order for it to breathe and function, those are all perceptions that we have about what we think we are, because we identify ourselves as our body. So, the error is that, in that identification, that you believe that you're this finite, solid, thing, the solid form. The truth is is you're not a solid form, you're a watery essence. Your body literally is made up of water and the Holy Spirit and that's all it is. That's all it is, okay, so, you know. And perception is strong because our thoughts are creative, so whatever we perceive and believe is true, that's the reality we form out of the plasma substance that is within us. And that plasma is everywhere. It's not just within us, it's ... So, when you have somebody who, who is realized let's say ... See, we have to understand that a lot of times words limit us, and in this kind of a discussion we have to be careful because there are, as you said, so many different levels to this and so many levels to its understanding. But let's just come to the physical level though. Is that when, if you have somebody who's realized, or who is enlightened, have they realized in their own cells that they are not the body, and in that way, have achieved (whether it's immortality or spiritual freedom or whatever) but is that because they've embodied that understanding? Well, probably. Because I think where this kind of goes to and when it comes down to healing, okay, conditions that illnesses that we have or conditions that we go through that we think we need some sort of a drug to heal, or we need an operation, for example, without realizing that you've got this water of life within you that can self-heal. And there's a lot of studies and things all over the world, monks have proven it, Yogi's have proven it, medicines and hospitals in China have proven it, that the conditions can be healed in the instant. When somebody understands that their body is fluid, its malleable, it can change its structure from moment to moment, and that's what I'm talking about. How most of us believe the body is fixed. We believe that we can't do anything about the conditions that are going on because it's genetics, it's in our DNA. You know, it's this or its that, but the truth is, is that the body was created to heal itself, okay. And especially if you can imagine that it is a fluid substance - it's not static. So, I'll go back to the Course in Miracles again because it talks about that when you start to have real vision, and you start to see the real world, what you're going to notice is light around everything, or all of a sudden, something won't appear as solid - you'll see it as moving waves of light. Okay, that that's what's real, okay, not this impenetrable substance that is so difficult to change. But, when you when you think of somebody who has an illness, Aingeal Rose, and we've known many people who have said, "Oh, I've tried all this mind control. I've tried prayers. I've tried meditation. I've tried this." Why would they continue to suffer, or why would they continue to be in pain when they have gone to so much trouble to alter their perception? Because I don't know that they're altering it in the right way, and of course I can't speak for who's ever doing that, okay. But we're talking about the fundamental belief about who you are, okay. Okay. Where maybe when you say... you know, the giveaway was when you said 'mind control'. Yes. Well, what do we... what are we trying to control, seriously? Because the real fundamental error is in the belief that you're a static physical form in the first place, Yes. Okay, and then we ... we believe that first, and then we tried to somehow force it to change, okay. Well, it is true that our perceptions of reality are based on what we believe is true about reality. Okay, and we've seen that in our own lives, you know. We've manifested lots of things, and some things instantaneously. So, we know that there is some sort of a field that responds to your thoughts. Yes. Okay. But sometimes it's not as simple. And it is simple, but not at the level if you can realize that the whole world is in a perception of materialism. Yes. We are in a perception of a material universe, you know, the spiritual universe seems to be something away, or something we go to after the fact. After you die then you go to the spiritual universe, but now you're in this material universe, but you're not. The truth is you're not, that every single thing you look out on is also fluid, okay. And if you saw correctly, if you perceived correctly, you could look at this tree, for example, that's in front of us right now, and instead of seeing that definite form, you would also see all the light waves that are moving and streaming and flowing through that. You'd see the molecules, okay. Those people who could put their hands through a wall, for example, know it's because that's not solid, okay. Now, to shift that belief can be very difficult for us. We are so rooted in the belief in solid fixed objects. We're rooted in the belief that we are an object. Mm-hmm Okay. So, is that an indication of how powerful we really are, that we created this illusion, and we did such a good job of it that we totally believed it, and that we even have difficulty unraveling it - disbelieving it in other words? Well, I think we're at a point now where nobody even gets it that the outer world is an effect of inner beliefs. Nobody even gets it. Everybody walks around as if the material universe is real and we try to maneuver our way, you know, throughout the physical universe with all the perceived limitations that are going on in it, and we just take it for granted that this is reality. So, nobody questions, really, the fact that they could... that their consciousness would have a hand in developing this in any way. Yes. Okay so if you look at, and you know, what makes me think of today too, us here we are. You mentioned that we're sitting up here on Pilot Butte, we're surrounded by numerous volcanic mountains, actually, dormant volcanoes. There's a complete circle of them actually, from where we're standing right now. And you have often said to me when we've gone by, things like this that are magnificently beautiful, but also obvious that there was incredible violence in the creation of these. And where my mind is going to now is, what was going on with reality at that time to produce those sorts of conditions? And I'm starting to look differently now at everything that we see. Well, what was the state of consciousness of the world okay, to have violence like that erupt? What was here? Who was here? You know, obviously something, okay. There always is a cause and effect. And aren't we seeing somewhat the same now when we look at the climate change that's going on now? I mean, there's violence everywhere, not only amongst humans, but in nature itself. Look at the wildfires in California. Look at the Hurricanes. Look at the destruction all over the world that has been caused by Nature herself. So, you're saying that's a reflection of the consciousness of the people that are here on this planet right now? I think there is some causal level of it somewhere that we don't understand, but if people even now understood that there is a huge gigantic plasma field that is life, that can still mold and change all of that, and if we understood that that's running through us, and that we're composed of that. Right. And our intelligence, our consciousness can direct that. I think that if people really understood that and could embrace that at the level that it is really true at that causal level, you might see things shift quite quickly. But that isn't what we see. We see people, a majority of people, (not everyone, of course) but the majority, that takes... that accepts totally that we're in effect of things, okay. That things are going on without our conscious choosing, without our... you know, we didn't say it was okay, it's just going on, and we're in effect of all these things. Okay. All right we're going to take a quick studio break here. 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We really don't. Well, we have to be clear to them, we're not making any of this wrong. We're not making the dense physical appearance wrong. Yes. We're just saying that it isn't correct. Yes. Okay, so it isn't wrong that there's this physical universe. Sure. It's quite beautiful. Yes. Okay, and we could enjoy many things here. What we're discussing though, is the misperception about ourselves. Yes. In relation to it. Who we actually really are, all right. You know, the big question always is, "Who am I, Who am I?" you know, and "Why am I here, Why am I here. Who am I, Why am I here?" Well, the who who are you is water and the Holy Spirit. You are a living embodiment of water and the Holy Spirit, and that water in your body is intelligent, its malleable. It changes its structure according to what you want it to do, and we don't see ourselves that way. We see ourselves as powerless beings in effect of outer things, as opposed to everything is internal. That magic elixir of life. You know, in this little awakening that I had today, prior to that I was having a memory of living a lifetime where I was studying a lot of esoteric material and I wanted the answer. I wanted to know. I knew that there was a magic elixir to life, and when we think of ritualistic magic, right, we think of people who do rituals of any kind whether it's, you know, witchcraft, or religions, you know, who do ceremonies, or druids, or any of those people, right? They're all, you know, appealing to the outer elements right, to produce a certain effect. They want that magic. What's the magic herb that'll make somebody well? What's the magic sentence. What's the phrase? Okay, whereas what this is saying is, the magic that everybody is looking for, that genie in a bottle, is inside your own body. It's called water and the Holy Spirit, okay. That's the magic elixir. You can search high and low for it, outside yourself, looking for the secret. The secret is within your own body. It's what you actually made of. Right. You also did speak earlier, before we got here, about the false self, and what was interesting about that was that (we're talking about the false perception of our Self) and it seems that that's where the word "false" comes from. It's like the FALL self F-A-L-L S-E-L-F. It's the self that has fallen to this density. Well, fallen to the misperception of ownership. I have to remind us (yes) that we're not making this level of reality bad. Right. Okay. But it is false. It is false, and that we are the fallen angels. Now, a lot of people - wait! I don't... I know. I think... Well, wait a minute, wait a minute, wasn't that back in the Bible, and somebody bred with the daughters of men, and that was a no-no. No, the the way I'm calling the false self, which is the FALL SELF, is the self that fell into the perception, that it's only a physical, that it's a finite, dense, physical body, and it has no power or control over, and that this is what it is. Now, might that have been something that we did on purpose in order to experience physicality? Well, Ahonu, I know there's people who say that, but I've never bought that myself. No, nor I, but at the same time there are people who, listening to us, would raise that very question, because as we know, when we published these particular talks (whether it by way of podcast, or YouTube, or on our website or however) we get people commenting, and I'd like to address that, because I know that is something that people will will want to address. They'll want to know. I personally can't imagine that I would have ever deliberately chosen to forget who I was, or separate myself from my own cosmic life source energy, even though you haven't really separated yourself from it - you believe you have. Yes. You believe you're alone in this universe. So, that brings us back to the very opening statement that I made when we started earlier, and that was about the persception... Why would, why would a spirit being, with all the glory and power available to us in that state, why would we choose, or believe, (or engineer it in such a way that we would believe) that we are in a finite universe and in a causal body. Why would we do that? I don't know that we did. I really don't. I don't know that we were up there as spirits fully awake and aware, and said, let's go down and forget who we are and fall into density. I just... that just does not ring true to me. But that's also the same question that I raised in the beginning - was there then, some physical thing that happened, or was there some fallen angel that maybe (and I'm purposely going down this road because I want to pull this out of you, Aingeal Rose) about Satan and the belief in death, and evil, and all of that. So, was there something that happened in the spirit world that caused this to happen to us? Now, I know that's going external again - it's saying us and them - but I'm trying to get at, was there some event, (like a cosmic event, or a universal event, or a spiritual event) that would cause this to happen if we didn't create it ourselves? Well, I honestly don't know that because I'm not in the records, but what I can tell you is that, the fall that I'm talking about is, is at the perceptual level. Okay, so in other words, yeah, in this awakening today, what I heard was that Satanism is the material universe, okay, but we have to be really careful here because what it was meaning by that statement is the idea that the material universe is true reality, that things that are solid and fixed and impenetrable and not able to affect, be affected by the mind instantaneously, for example, that it's not pliable, that it operates under fixed laws that you can't change, that that that is what it was calling Satanism. The belief that materialism controls us, and we don't ... we don't have an effect on it, okay. So, we are fallen angels? Well, fallen in perception, not fallen in the sense of you committed a sin (right) and now you have to be punished. We're not talking about that at all. There is no sin in perceiving a physical universe. There's no sin in having a material universe. It's not a sin at all. It's a distortion in perception that unfortunately makes us suffer, makes us age, makes us die. Because if you believe that you're a physical body, okay, some part of you knows you're not. Some part of you knows that your true self is spiritual, okay, it's energetic. So, when you say, "oh, no I'm gonna hang on to the fact that I am this physical form", that's very hard to change. "I'm gonna hang on to it" - that takes a whole lot of energy. It takes a lot of energy to try to maintain a reality that isn't really true! Let's say, a perception of reality okay. It takes a lot of energy to maintain a perception of a reality that isn't really true. So, that we get tired of having to do that all the time, all the time we're trying to keep that alive, so we get tired, and that's what makes us sick, and that's what makes us age, and that's what makes us die, okay. Because we actually have... speaking of death, we have the belief that the only way out of this universe, out of the physicality and to go back to spirit is that we have to die. That's how we go back to spirit, okay, when we want to go home. But the truth is is we don't understand that nothing... that spiritual universe didn't go anywhere. It's right here. It's right now. It's running through your body, okay, as water. And when I say "Holy Spirit" I'm not talking about something outside of you. I'm talking about your own holy spiritual self, which is who you really are. That and the plasma field which we called water, okay, is inside your body and it does what you tell it to do. All right, we're going to have to leave it there. That has been an absolutely stunning and thought-provoking little session that we had today, so we're going to continue this next week, and do check back with us because we're going to carry on where we will explore the whole thing about energy that's needed in order to live here, and why we do it. So, until then, bye bye from myself Ahonu and from Aingeal Rose. Bye. You have been listening to Aingeal Rose & Ahonu on World of Empowerment Radio, your station for practical spirituality in a changing world! Let us know your thoughts on it all. We hope you enjoy our discussion at sunset on Pilot Butte. Remember this discussion was in two parts, so make sure you are subscribed to us on YouTube, iTunes, Stitcher Radio, Google Play or on our podcast site at http://honesttogodseries.com so you never miss an episode. Also remember to check out our new World of Empowerment website where we have a whole new program of spiritual goodies for you. 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